Page 1 of 3

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2021 7:11 pm
by TheJimster
I can confirm 100% that there was no update or notification from the car before all the assist warnings started going off.

If memory serves me correctly, the email from VW did did say that the assist systems would be unavailable as soon as the update started to download (rather than when it started to install). Evidently the download started in the background without any intervention or notification.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2021 8:03 pm
by Deleted User 192
stevelar wrote: Tue Oct 12, 2021 4:16 pm Thanks. Just checked and you're right. A software update was waiting to be downloaded. So I tapped "Install" and it said it was going to do it when the car was turned off. Not sure how long it takes (any ideas?). Also, would that explain all the errors, or will they likely return after the update?!!

So that’s part 1, it is supposed to take 30 minutes to install.

You shouldn’t see those errors again. Including when part 2 downloads and installs.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:15 pm
by Sherlock
TheJimster wrote: Tue Oct 12, 2021 5:59 pm I had exactly this driving home today! Probably 30 seconds or so after all the warnings, I got a popup notifying me of the software update.

Fortunately I'd seen discussions about these warnings, and as others have said, the email from VW did indicate that assist systems would be degraded during the installation, but the process could have been better (e.g. if you got an in-car notification before all the assist systems go offline!)
I think I have just experienced this too. Got into my car and was checking a few messages on phone before setting off and after a few minutes got the warning messages. No prior indication that an update was available or was downloading - just the error messages.

If I wasn't on this forum I wouldn't have thought to check System Updates on the infotainment system, but having done so I found that a download was in progress. Once the download finished I got a message saying I could 'complete my journey' and 'the update' would be available to download when I switched off the car. Had to drive home without front assist/lane assist etc. (why can't these work when a download is happening? I could understand why during the install, but the download?), and having switched off the car I assume the update is currently happening. No information on what the update is but presumably 2.3 part one.
I am really not impressed by any of this, and having leased my car initially expecting to change in a couple of years to another (hopefully improved) ID.3 my current feelings are that I will be seriously considering alternatives unless things change dramatically on the software and update process front. Especially as I am not even aware of anything that's in the 2.3 update that is actually a huge benefit to have.
PS - anyone actually using the We-Charge app??

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:31 pm
by Deleted User 192
Sherlock wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:15 pm If I wasn't on this forum I wouldn't have thought to check System Updates on the infotainment system, but having done so I found that a download was in progress. Once the download finished I got a message saying I could 'complete my journey' and 'the update' would be available to download when I switched off the car. Had to drive home without front assist/lane assist etc. (why can't these work when a download is happening? I could understand why during the install, but the download?), and having switched off the car I assume the update is currently happening. No information on what the update is but presumably 2.3 part one.
I am really not impressed by any of this, and having leased my car initially expecting to change in a couple of years to another (hopefully improved) ID.3 my current feelings are that I will be seriously considering alternatives unless things change dramatically on the software and update process front. Especially as I am not even aware of anything that's in the 2.3 update that is actually a huge benefit to have.

Presumably you read the 2.3 information?

https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/en/owners- ... e-2-3.html

Mine was done before they created that page, I expected they would have included a link to it in the emails sent asking for update approval.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:55 pm
by mish
scott28tt wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:31 pm
Sherlock wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:15 pm If I wasn't on this forum I wouldn't have thought to check System Updates on the infotainment system, but having done so I found that a download was in progress. Once the download finished I got a message saying I could 'complete my journey' and 'the update' would be available to download when I switched off the car. Had to drive home without front assist/lane assist etc. (why can't these work when a download is happening? I could understand why during the install, but the download?), and having switched off the car I assume the update is currently happening. No information on what the update is but presumably 2.3 part one.
I am really not impressed by any of this, and having leased my car initially expecting to change in a couple of years to another (hopefully improved) ID.3 my current feelings are that I will be seriously considering alternatives unless things change dramatically on the software and update process front. Especially as I am not even aware of anything that's in the 2.3 update that is actually a huge benefit to have.

Presumably you read the 2.3 information?

https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/en/owners- ... e-2-3.html

Mine was done before they created that page, I expected they would have included a link to it in the emails sent asking for update approval.
Aha, so nothing wrong then. Fair enough, the process has been explained on the info page. The terminology is still confusing since a download should not mess with the state of the current system. They could at least highlight this fact in a better way.
During the process of updating the front camera for driver assist systems, the camera-based driver assistance systems (e.g. Lane Assist, Travel Assist, ...) are not available for safety reasons from the start of the download to the completion of the installation.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 3:44 pm
by Sherlock
scott28tt wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:31 pm
Sherlock wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:15 pm If I wasn't on this forum I wouldn't have thought to check System Updates on the infotainment system, but having done so I found that a download was in progress. Once the download finished I got a message saying I could 'complete my journey' and 'the update' would be available to download when I switched off the car. Had to drive home without front assist/lane assist etc. (why can't these work when a download is happening? I could understand why during the install, but the download?), and having switched off the car I assume the update is currently happening. No information on what the update is but presumably 2.3 part one.
I am really not impressed by any of this, and having leased my car initially expecting to change in a couple of years to another (hopefully improved) ID.3 my current feelings are that I will be seriously considering alternatives unless things change dramatically on the software and update process front. Especially as I am not even aware of anything that's in the 2.3 update that is actually a huge benefit to have.

Presumably you read the 2.3 information?

https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/en/owners- ... e-2-3.html

Mine was done before they created that page, I expected they would have included a link to it in the emails sent asking for update approval.
Thanks Scott28tt. Yes I did read that, but it was quite a few weeks ago and I had kind of forgotten about the 2.3 update as it has been talked about for so long that I wondered if it was ever going to appear.

I also hadn't really picked up that the assist systems would be unavailable from the start of the download, rather than the start of the install although I now see that it did say that in the information. I can't see why its is necessary to disable them if all that is happening at that point is a download though?

I also had (incorrectly) expected that there would be a message in car before any element of the download/install began.

I was parked when the warnings about the assist systems started pinging away, but it would have been very distracting if I had been driving at the time.

So I still think there is room for a lot of improvement in the way these updates happen and are communicated. It all seems a bit amateur and poorly designed/thought out to me. Even when the download was happening and there was a bar moving across the screen presumably to indicate download progress the screen also displayed '0 of 0 MB downloaded' the whole time.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 8:25 pm
by TheJimster
I agree with everything you've said there!

Even though I knew that the assistance systems would be unavailable from the point the download started (though like you I can't see why that should be the case), for everything to kick off in-car without any prior notification is far from ideal.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:08 pm
by Deleted User 192
Everyone who greed to the 2.3 update could have read the article I posted, if so I’m not sure what’s surprising about the actual behaviour.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 1:24 pm
by George.S
stevelar wrote: Tue Oct 12, 2021 3:35 pm Hi,

My ID-3 has thrown three faults today whilst driving around town (all out of the blue) and I would appreciate some advice on how to solve them.

1. "Front Assist Availability is Limited"
2. "Error: Dynamic Road Sign Display"
3. "Lane Assist is Currently Unavailable"

The windscreen is clean around the camera and the VW logo on the front grille (where I think the radar sensor is) is also pretty clean.

Would a factory reset help or would that have far-reaching consequences?!

Thanks,

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 1:28 pm
by George.S
I have the same problem, it happened about 4 days ago without warning, I contacted the garage who asked me to clean sensors but this didn’t work so it is booked into garage for Friday 20th Oct may check for updates first

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 1:35 pm
by Utumno
This just means you've got the first part of the 2.3 OTA update. Follow the update instructions.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 2:14 pm
by TheJimster
George.S wrote: Sat Oct 16, 2021 1:28 pm I have the same problem, it happened about 4 days ago without warning, I contacted the garage who asked me to clean sensors but this didn’t work so it is booked into garage for Friday 20th Oct may check for updates first
Shortly after the assist system warnings, did you see a notification pop up indicating that a software update was available?

When it's ready to install, you'll see an option on the goodbye screen to start the installation. First update will take about an hour, and will need the car to be at >50% soc and not being charged.

Even if this was something else, it is not terribly reassuring that your garage were seemingly not aware that the 2.3 update causes this sort of behaviour.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2021 7:35 pm
by SiDai
Hi
Interesting read even if I don't understand some of the explanations completely. I too have experienced exactly the same error messages and had last week agreed to the installation of the latest software upgrade. What puzzles me is that shouldn't VW be notifying their customers what to expect rather then let them experience the problem and then have to deal with the irate customers. Again like I have said before there appears to be a lot of guess work and surmising as to what is going on and causing the problems. Without any real experts on the forum, I would treat some of the suggestions on here with a pinch of salt and approach VW directly.

It makes no logical sense what so ever, for malfunctions to appear as part of an upgrade and would suggest that these are possibly 'bugs' that need to be drawn to VWs attention.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2021 8:45 pm
by Deleted User 192
SiDai wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 7:35 pm Hi
Interesting read even if I don't understand some of the explanations completely. I too have experienced exactly the same error messages and had last week agreed to the installation of the latest software upgrade. What puzzles me is that shouldn't VW be notifying their customers what to expect rather then let them experience the problem and then have to deal with the irate customers. Again like I have said before there appears to be a lot of guess work and surmising as to what is going on and causing the problems. Without any real experts on the forum, I would treat some of the suggestions on here with a pinch of salt and approach VW directly.

It makes no logical sense what so ever, for malfunctions to appear as part of an upgrade and would suggest that these are possibly 'bugs' that need to be drawn to VWs attention.

The information about the warnings was in the email from which you agreed to receive the update.

Some of the advice being given here is based on that information, plus there’s an official VW ID. group on Facebook where VW have shared some tips.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2021 9:05 pm
by SiDai
scott28tt wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 8:45 pm
SiDai wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 7:35 pm Hi
Interesting read even if I don't understand some of the explanations completely. I too have experienced exactly the same error messages and had last week agreed to the installation of the latest software upgrade. What puzzles me is that shouldn't VW be notifying their customers what to expect rather then let them experience the problem and then have to deal with the irate customers. Again like I have said before there appears to be a lot of guess work and surmising as to what is going on and causing the problems. Without any real experts on the forum, I would treat some of the suggestions on here with a pinch of salt and approach VW directly.

It makes no logical sense what so ever, for malfunctions to appear as part of an upgrade and would suggest that these are possibly 'bugs' that need to be drawn to VWs attention.

The information about the warnings was in the email from which you agreed to receive the update.

Some of the advice being given here is based on that information, plus there’s an official VW ID. group on Facebook where VW have shared some tips.

The e-mail was in German and just to reiterate why would malfunctions, in the form of hazard warnings, appear as part of an upgrade? It is a rather clumsy way of communicating them and potentially dangerous. The blanket use of hazard warnings, that are no different to what would be displayed if there was an actual malfunction, only serve to undermine their credibility in the long run and the likelihood of drivers taking notice of them in future. A much neater solution would to be to display a simple message such as, "For the duration of the upgrade currently being installed the following functions of the car will be unavailable:"

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2021 9:21 pm
by Deleted User 192
SiDai wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 9:05 pm
scott28tt wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 8:45 pm
SiDai wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 7:35 pm Hi
Interesting read even if I don't understand some of the explanations completely. I too have experienced exactly the same error messages and had last week agreed to the installation of the latest software upgrade. What puzzles me is that shouldn't VW be notifying their customers what to expect rather then let them experience the problem and then have to deal with the irate customers. Again like I have said before there appears to be a lot of guess work and surmising as to what is going on and causing the problems. Without any real experts on the forum, I would treat some of the suggestions on here with a pinch of salt and approach VW directly.

It makes no logical sense what so ever, for malfunctions to appear as part of an upgrade and would suggest that these are possibly 'bugs' that need to be drawn to VWs attention.

The information about the warnings was in the email from which you agreed to receive the update.

Some of the advice being given here is based on that information, plus there’s an official VW ID. group on Facebook where VW have shared some tips.

The e-mail was in German and just to reiterate why would malfunctions, in the form of hazard warnings, appear as part of an upgrade? It is a rather clumsy way of communicating them and potentially dangerous. The blanket use of hazard warnings, that are no different to what would be displayed if there was an actual malfunction, only serve to undermine their credibility in the long run and the likelihood of drivers taking notice of them in future. A much neater solution would to be to display a simple message such as, "For the duration of the upgrade currently being installed the following functions of the car will be unavailable:"

It shouldn’t have been in German, apparently that relates to when you setup your VW account.

The same information was published here: https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/en/owners- ... e-2-3.html

You accepted to receive the update in spite of your email being in a foreign language, that’s brave.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2021 10:01 pm
by Utumno
SiDai wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 9:05 pm A much neater solution would to be to display a simple message such as, "For the duration of the upgrade currently being installed the following functions of the car will be unavailable:"

Well yes, but VW didn't implement that.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 7:35 am
by G43FAN
In order to implement a messaging system VW would have had to code that into the software in multiple languages with various iterations already, or they would have had to send an update to allow the message prior to the update!! Whether they should have done that isn't up for debate as they didn't Instead they chose to use the existing coding which tells you something is unavailable, almost the same as if you are in Snow or other conditions which block the camera view. (Get used to these messages in Winter if my previous VW is anything to go by)
They then informed people via an email which you had to accept in order to proceed. If people didn't read the email, which it is obvious a lot of people didn't bother, then I don't see how those same people can moan about the way this is implemented.
I also think this is a British issue.. we're looking for someone to say 'Excuse me Sir, terribly sorry but there will be an update shortly, there will be some minor inconvenience and some messages, nothing to worry about, cup of tea Guvnor?'.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 8:32 am
by Deleted User 192
G43FAN wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 7:35 am They then informed people via an email which you had to accept in order to proceed. If people didn't read the email, which it is obvious a lot of people didn't bother, then I don't see how those same people can moan about the way this is implemented.

Amen.

Re: 3 new faults today. Help!

Posted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 8:40 am
by mish
G43FAN wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 7:35 am In order to implement a messaging system VW would have had to code that into the software in multiple languages with various iterations already, or they would have had to send an update to allow the message prior to the update!! Whether they should have done that isn't up for debate as they didn't Instead they chose to use the existing coding which tells you something is unavailable, almost the same as if you are in Snow or other conditions which block the camera view. (Get used to these messages in Winter if my previous VW is anything to go by)
They then informed people via an email which you had to accept in order to proceed. If people didn't read the email, which it is obvious a lot of people didn't bother, then I don't see how those same people can moan about the way this is implemented.
I also think this is a British issue.. we're looking for someone to say 'Excuse me Sir, terribly sorry but there will be an update shortly, there will be some minor inconvenience and some messages, nothing to worry about, cup of tea Guvnor?'.
I am a German software developer and I do not think it's a "British issue". I honestly think the way they have communicated this is not up to standards. Fair enough if the update runs in the background. Fine that there was an email.
I think it's simply an awful user experience to separate the "warning" from the "system" it is meant for, especially if pushing a message to the car could be part of the update procedure. It's really not a difficult technological problem. It's just poor software design and not good enough. I am pretty sure VW is aware that this can be improved and I am hoping for a better experience in the future.