Delivery time

[Utumno]

Going by how my came through it was supposed to be week 39 (2021) build.
On the 19th November it was in the paintshop so I would imagine the only process before that would be the body build. The 19th Nov was the latter end of week 46.
Then on the 25th November it was in transit to Emden.
So I don't believe these vehicles are sitting about part built.

Totally, but then why do week 40 vehicles still exist ? I literally can’t puzzle out why VW wouldn’t just reschedule the build week like they have with many others.

The only reason i could think of in this scenario is to have some sort of ‘first in first out’ system (ie build the week 40 cars first without rescheduling) but that seems … unlikely.

I guess the proof will come when our Tour eventually escapes the factory. If it’s MY22 then it’s been part-built, if it’s MY22.5 it hasn’t. I can’t imagine for one minute that they’d retool the line for MY22 hangers on like the week40 club.

It also goes to highlight that two identical cars ordered only a few days apart can have a massive delivery disparity - its been nearly 3 months since your Tour escaped the factory and there still isn’t the faintest hint of ours escaping Stalag Zwickau, yet we were only one build week apart, and one week apart in order dates!

[sidehaas]

[quote=Utumno post_id=20959 time=1644689089

Totally, but then why do week 40 vehicles still exist ? I literally can’t puzzle out why VW wouldn’t just reschedule the build week like they have with many others.
[/quote]

It seems to me that when confirmed (as opposed to estimated) build weeks started to be missed, it took a while until they started being rescheduled. I may be wrong but I don't remember seeing anyone with a confirmed build week of 40 or before that was actually rescheduled. The system has stayed at the same build week for those orders forever - as least until very recently - regardless of when the car was actually built (or not).
Sometime in the early week 40s this approach seems to have changed.
I had confirmed week 42, then in week 46 I was told build had been delayed to week 45 but it still wasn't built (a strange conversation) then in week 50/51 it was actually built. I think there are a few on here with confirmed week 45 or 46 that hasn't moved in the system and maybe a few week 49. But I get the impression that from early week 40s onwards VW have started to proactively change the dates in the system far more. And possibly build in more fat to the schedule at the same time, or else start time to make more room for other models. It was also just before that time when the last lucky few of us went through (early August orders) who had their cars delivered in acceptable timescales.

[Skippy]

Whichever way you spin it, VW’s communications with dealers and customers (and probably it’s planning process) are abysmal.

[Deleted User 1733]

I've just come to accept that regardless of what those little Week ** numbers say, your car will turn up whenever, I fully expect the majority of delayed cars will start to get built faster and faster as the year goes on, I considered cancelling and going for the new ICE Focus estate * I like them * and trying again with EV next year but I'm now just going to wait as the rumours of face lift in 2023 could end up being a style I don't like. Choosing a Max has clearly been a bad one same as Tour buyers, I think the Electric seats and HUD's are the biggest downfall for delay's.

[Bubba82]

Just had a look at forums of other cars produced at Zwickau, sad I know but makes interesting reading
Cupra born - ordering delayed from November to March but possibly cars available in March and possibly very short lead times but limited info to go on
ID5 - lack of contribution so may not be popular lol
ID4 - similar story to ID3 delays and cars getting pushed back
Q4 - very popular similar story to ID3 delays and cars getting pushed back
So in summery is the delays caused by the cupra born taking priority shortly and them waiting to see how popular the born and ID5 are with how many orders they get….hopefully none so our cars get bought forward!!
Most contributions are to ID3 and Q4 forums I believe

[mediaguy]

Choosing a Max has clearly been a bad one same as Tour buyers, I think the Electric seats and HUD's are the biggest downfall for delay's.

I'm certainly interested to see what happens as I've basically bought a max without the sunroof.

[Uphamid3]

Whilst it is possible that part-built cars are hanging around, logic would have to say that this isn’t possible, but I could be wrong of course.

However, when I visited MINI Plant Oxford, they have similar very advanced manufacturing techniques to all of the other high tech high volume manufacturers.

It is all computer controlled, and once a car has been allocated a build slot, it has to stay on schedule almost to the exact second. All of the components needed to build that particular customer order arrive on the line ‘just in time’.

Many of the major sub assemblies arrive on the line in completed form. So, for example, a dashboard arrives pre-built and completely pre-configured for each particular car, with all of the various individual options that have been ordered for that particular car built-in, fully wired and ready to ‘plug and play’.

As the semi-conductors needed in each vehicle are in most of these pre-manufactured major sub-assemblies, these have to be fitted in sequence. In the case of MINI for example, the body arrives on line, having been pre-manufactured and painted.

Protective covers are clipped to the vulnerable areas to protect the paint, and the robots remove the doors which are then uploaded to a conveyer overhead running in parallel with the main body. This provides the necessary access space for the automated production process to for example install the complete dash with just a little human intervention to perform the final wiring-up. The wiring looms, with all the necessary connections and chips all arrive pre-configured ready to install, again made exactly for that particular car.

The doors are refitted at the end of the line together with the wheels.

So with MINI at least, it would be completely impossible to part-build a car, because once it reaches the end of the line, it wouldn’t be possible for the automated process to cope with a vehicle which has advanced further in production than would be normal for a particular part to be added.

The total production time ‘in plant’ is around 20 hours, on the lines themselves much less. MINI Plant Oxford is relatively small by global standards, but when running at normal capacity they manage to pop-out a MINI off the line every 67 seconds.

If these had to be stored for any length of time, the whole of Oxfordshire would be overwhelmed with them after a few weeks!

Goodness knows what’s going on at VW!

[Deleted User 1733]

Just watched a video on YT that Hyundai * edited ahhaah KIA * has dropped the side assist system from the Ionic 5 which drops the autonomy down form 2.0 to 1.5 as they can't get the sensors ... This ties in with Max and Tour models being delayed.

[ItshardtobuyId3]

Whilst it is possible that part-built cars are hanging around, logic would have to say that this isn’t possible, but I could be wrong of course.

However, when I visited MINI Plant Oxford, they have similar very advanced manufacturing techniques to all of the other high tech high volume manufacturers.

It is all computer controlled, and once a car has been allocated a build slot, it has to stay on schedule almost to the exact second. All of the components needed to build that particular customer order arrive on the line ‘just in time’.

Many of the major sub assemblies arrive on the line in completed form. So, for example, a dashboard arrives pre-built and completely pre-configured for each particular car, with all of the various individual options that have been ordered for that particular car built-in, fully wired and ready to ‘plug and play’.

As the semi-conductors needed in each vehicle are in most of these pre-manufactured major sub-assemblies, these have to be fitted in sequence. In the case of MINI for example, the body arrives on line, having been pre-manufactured and painted.

Protective covers are clipped to the vulnerable areas to protect the paint, and the robots remove the doors which are then uploaded to a conveyer overhead running in parallel with the main body. This provides the necessary access space for the automated production process to for example install the complete dash with just a little human intervention to perform the final wiring-up. The wiring looms, with all the necessary connections and chips all arrive pre-configured ready to install, again made exactly for that particular car.

The doors are refitted at the end of the line together with the wheels.

So with MINI at least, it would be completely impossible to part-build a car, because once it reaches the end of the line, it wouldn’t be possible for the automated process to cope with a vehicle which has advanced further in production than would be normal for a particular part to be added.

The total production time ‘in plant’ is around 20 hours, on the lines themselves much less. MINI Plant Oxford is relatively small by global standards, but when running at normal capacity they manage to pop-out a MINI off the line every 67 seconds.

If these had to be stored for any length of time, the whole of Oxfordshire would be overwhelmed with them after a few weeks!

Goodness knows what’s going on at VW!

I’ve been saying this here for a while. I just don’t believe VW is building cars with parts missing, storing part-built cars and putting the missing parts in them in later. It’s probably not making me very popular on here but it is just ridiculous. They definitely aren’t putting chips into cars after they are built. There are plenty of videos that show how they are made and there is no “chip putting in line”.

What I suspect is happening is they are building the cars they can actually finish. They schedule everything up but because “Just in time” is utterly broken at the moment, they have to keep rescheduling builds. The simpler the build the more likely the car will make it out of the factory. They clearly aren’t setup to work like this normally and that’s why it looks so random.

Tour and Max must use some particularly hard to obtain parts (battery, HUD. The BW40 cars could possibly be ones that have fallen though the change in build system? Who knows, but Pro performance life models seem to be stuck in BW40… Maybe it’s just a database error and BW40 cars have accidentally been skipped.

[Utumno]

Don’t worry it’s not about popularity We’re all just trying to see some patterns in the tea leaves here.

[Smitten]

I don't think cars are being part constructed and then parked somewhere. I think sub assemblies are probably put together and then stored for many vehicles of a specific type which are then called up from storage once that vehicle is actually built. JiT is designed to minimise inventory and storage so it would seem odd if they were doing the opposite. We have seen videos of the whole front facia and instrumentation being inserted in the body shell so I suspect part built vehicles exist as large sub assemblies like that awaiting missing integrated circuits.

[Utumno]

Pro performance life models seem to be stuck in BW40…

Which ones ? I can't see any Life's stuck in bw40 on the spreddy at all. What am I missing ?

[DumfriesDik]

Whichever way you spin it, VW’s communications with dealers and customers (and probably it’s planning process) are abysmal.

Yup, we are left scratching our heads, which is what VW seem to be doing as well. The communication is terrible, the worst I've experienced.


It's about time manufacturers moved on from 'Just In Time' to 'Just In Case'.

[Gwyver]

Yup, we are left scratching our heads, which is what VW seem to be doing as well. The communication is terrible, the worst I've experienced.


It's about time manufacturers moved on from 'Just In Time' to 'Just In Case'.

'Just in Case' is already happening.
As an example, semiconductor supplier NXP recently reported that automotive customers are now willing to sign multi-year non-cancellable, non-returnable contracts in order to secure their chip requirements.
This represents a huge change from the normal 3~6month rolling forecast purchasing processes.

VW (and other vehicle manufacturers) scheduling problems are made worse because they don't directly purchase/assemble the semiconductors. They buy Control Units and high-tech sensor modules from multiple automotive component manufacturers - and each of these suppliers will have their own chip availability issues.
An important ID.3 control unit - is the ICAS1 - made by Continental (the tyre maker!). More details here if you're interested https://mag.continental.com/en/in-car-server

At present it must be a nightmare to work as a production scheduler in a car plant.

[Dogcow]

Urgh. Wife is getting cold feet, test driving the Kona Electric and MG ZS EV today by the looks of it. If anything it will be interesting to see what they quote on delivery.

[MLB_ID3]

Urgh. Wife is getting cold feet, test driving the Kona Electric and MG ZS EV today by the looks of it. If anything it will be interesting to see what they quote on delivery.

I had a look at the MG ZS EV, they have stock cars available so I suspect pretty quick. I've not test driven one tho. Let me know how you get on.

[the.kes]

Going by how my came through it was supposed to be week 39 (2021) build.
On the 19th November it was in the paintshop so I would imagine the only process before that would be the body build. The 19th Nov was the latter end of week 46.
Then on the 25th November it was in transit to Emden.
So I don't believe these vehicles are sitting about part built.

Logistically, how are they moving them around without semi conductors installed or do they just put the minimum in them to get them off the production line?

[tomstring]

Great news you’ll be getting your car soon. I popped into my dealership yesterday for an update. We had a similar conversation about p/x values since it was originally valued last August. They were happy to reappraise once I get a delivery date and/or let me sell separately and pay a cast deposit instead.

Yeah he said the tool they use to get part exchange value is quite a bit lower so I'd make more money going through motorway or webuyanycar most likely so I think I'll do that. I would have preferred part exchange for the convenience but can't just let go of something like £3K like that!

Hi, have been tracking your updates as your timeline is very close to mine....I asked dealer about PE and although they upped their offer I have sold mine via Wizzle (a Carwow brand) who offered me 1200 above the increased PE. Dead easy, just a few pics, and they collect.

Hope you get car soon!

Many thanks. I’ve also now been made an offer by SEAT who will basically pay off the balance of my PCP and give me the residual equity as cash. I’ll likely gain an extra few thousand.

[ItshardtobuyId3]

Pro performance life models seem to be stuck in BW40…

Which ones ? I can't see any Life's stuck in bw40 on the spreddy at all. What am I missing ?

Oh, I’m probably wrong then. I thought I’d seen a post by someone that was BW40 with waiting on a life Pro but it would be in the tracker.

[Dogcow]

Urgh. Wife is getting cold feet, test driving the Kona Electric and MG ZS EV today by the looks of it. If anything it will be interesting to see what they quote on delivery.

I had a look at the MG ZS EV, they have stock cars available so I suspect pretty quick. I've not test driven one tho. Let me know how you get on.

Bad idea to take a grumpy three year old with us Didn’t drive either, August earliest for the Kona, MG only had one guy on sales and after waiting 10 minutes we quit and left. Sod it, will wait for the ID3