Charge rate dropped to 4kW

[LongMynd]

We've been charging successfully at home on Octopus Go with a Podpoint charger using Podpoint's app to set the timer. We were getting 6.5-7 kW.
Recently I selected the the reduced AC charge in order to top up using our son's solar panels. The charge rate dropped too 2kW.
When I switched off the 'reduced AC charge' and tried to charge the car overnight at home it has only been charging at 4kW.
It's going to take four nights to get the battery back up to 80%. That's a bit silly.
Any ideas, you wonderful people?

[365allthetime]

Where can you see rate of charge? Is there an online thing in the car or only via the app/ calculation?

[davidwalton]

One of the best ways to see detailed charge data on a cross-platform (car/charger) basis is to use the Tronity service: https://www.tronity.io/?lang=en

Here's an example of a recent 50kWh DC charge with the ID.3, from 24% to 85% charge:

[OB1CCFC]

I assume the Podpoint sets the charge timing for Octopus Go and the in car timer ‘location’ settings are all off? ( I would check).
I had a reduced charging rate when using the car settings but all was fine when I moved to my smart Wallbox …

[LongMynd]

Yes, OB1CCFC you're correct. I gave up using the car's timed charging months ago. I might perhaps try it again when we finally get software version 3.0 but on anything up to 2.3 times charging is rubbish.
The interesting thing is that if I switch off the pod point timing schedule and allow it to charge the car using full price daytime electricity it charges at 6kW. If I switch the pod point timer schedule on and then plug in the car I get the red light, the charging error message and then find the next morning that it only charged at 4kW.

[365allthetime]

One of the best ways to see detailed charge data on a cross-platform (car/charger) basis is to use the Tronity service: app.tronity.io

Here's an example of a recent 50kWh DC charge with the ID.3, from 24% to 85% charge:

50kWh_charge.png

Link doesn’t seem to work?

[OB1CCFC]

Yes, OB1CCFC you're correct. I gave up using the car's timed charging months ago. I might perhaps try it again when we finally get software version 3.0 but on anything up to 2.3 times charging is rubbish.
The interesting thing is that if I switch off the pod point timing schedule and allow it to charge the car using full price daytime electricity it charges at 6kW. If I switch the pod point timer schedule on and then plug in the car I get the red light, the charging error message and then find the next morning that it only charged at 4kW.

That behaviour seems as if the car thinks it’s doing it’s own ‘location’ based in car charging schedule. If all Location scheduling stuff has been removed I’m not sure what you can do besides pulling a fuse or just waiting it out (the ID3 does like it’s little reset ‘nap’).
Aa you say hopefully 2.4 and 3.x will sort this kind of thing out.

[davidwalton]

One of the best ways to see detailed charge data on a cross-platform (car/charger) basis is to use the Tronity service: https://www.tronity.io/?lang=en

Here's an example of a recent 50kWh DC charge with the ID.3, from 24% to 85% charge:

50kWh_charge.png

Link doesn’t seem to work?

Thanks for the error report - I've edited the link in the original post (and the quote above) & it should be working now.

[JCB]

Yes, OB1CCFC you're correct. I gave up using the car's timed charging months ago. I might perhaps try it again when we finally get software version 3.0 but on anything up to 2.3 times charging is rubbish.
The interesting thing is that if I switch off the pod point timing schedule and allow it to charge the car using full price daytime electricity it charges at 6kW. If I switch the pod point timer schedule on and then plug in the car I get the red light, the charging error message and then find the next morning that it only charged at 4kW.

This is exactly the behaviour I'm seeing on my Pod Point - did you ever get to the bottom of this?

[monkeyhanger]

Hate to break it to you, but both of our Cupra Borns (on 3.0) started doing the same thing about 5 weeks ago (I've been on holiday for 2 of those weeks). With changing absolutely no settings in the car at all except stop at 80%, and having no location/in-car schedules.

Our Ohme shows 32A at idle but is only pulling 16A on the chargers schedule to fill up in the Octopus Go cheap period. It has been flawless for 17 months of charging on ID3 and Born before that.

The change seems to coincide with the ntroduction of delayed/random switching brought in to protect the grid from mass switchover.

Ohme are supposedly on the case and I await a solution.

[monkeyhanger]

Just an update for anyone interested. Basically they're blaming the car, saying there's historical compatibility issues between ID3/ID4/Enyaq/Born and scheduling - this is clearly bollocks as charging under schedule worked flawlessly with the ID3 for a year and then the Born for 3 months.

Sods law, one of the Borns did a proper charge last night, no idea why, car settings are same in both, I suspect they implemented a fix and are waiting to see if it works. Here's the latest conversation:-

Hi Daryl,

I'll answer your queries/comments below, in red:-



The behaviour you are describing is a known issue for the ID3/4, Cupra and Skoda Enya when they are connected to a smart ev charger. They all share the same battery management system which has a problem with letting the charger control the sessions and especially delay the session after being plugged in rather than the car controlling the session.

I am aware that the newer, more compact Ohme charger has given a lot of EV owners of all marques trouble with scheduled charging (through EV forums), but the older unit like I have seems to be far more reliable and not usually giving many issues reported through the forums, even with VW/Cupra/Skoda EVs. Since installation in May 2021 to around 5 weeks ago, for both our 2 VW ID3s (owned May 2021 to June 2022) and their replacement Cupra Borns (owned from June 2022), we have had no issues with getting a full charge of around 28kWh in the 4 hour Octopus Go Window. With that in mind, I have had 15 months of flawless operation and this issue is new.

If the issues now experienced coincided with the change of cars from ID3 to Cupra Born, i'd be inclined to suspect the car is at fault, but they don't, I have had 3 months of normal operation with the Cupra, and nothing has changed with the Cupra Borns in either settings or any software updates.


What happens is that the car expects when it is plugged in to see power applied straight away, however with a delayed session such as one connected to Octopus GO the car limits the power if it doesn't see the power straight away thus resulting in a slower charge once the charger applies the power. We have a solution for this issue on the ID3/4 range and we are now looking if it is possible to implement this across the other effected cars on the MEB platform.

As i've had 15 months of faultless charging at 32A and then this issue, with no changes to the car/settings/software, the issue of delayed charging you describe hadn't previously occurred. As far as i'm aware, the VW ID3 and Cupra Born are identical under the skin, with the main difference being that the ID3 is far more likely to be running with older software as the updates from 2.3 to 2.4 (including a 12V battery upgrade) and then an over the air update to 3.0, and most UK Cupras were built with 3.0 already installed. If your solution works for an ID3/ID4 running v3.0 software, it's almost a certainty that it will work with a Cupra Born on v3.0. Is this "solution" an applied firmware upgrade to the charger and/or app changes or a recommendation to change settings on the vehicle itself?


I can see that last night (8th-9th) the car accepted the full 32A/7kW for the Go Window. Did you do anything different with this session?

I was surprised to get a proper 32A charge last night. As i've said previously, we have 2 x Cupra Borns that are identical in spec, except paint colour, running the same software and were built in the same month. Last night's charge was with our Blue Cupra Born. The previous 3 nights (06-08 Nov 22) were with our White Cupra Born. The Blue one was the first Cupra Born that I saw the charging issue. It may be a few days before we run the White Born's battery down enough to need 40-50% charge, to see if it is now charging at 32A. Have you changed anything on the charger (firmware) or the app prior to last night's successful 32A charge? Could you also confirm whether my charger's firmware is fully up to date? I will double check that between the 2 cars, all settings on the 2 cars are identical. If they are, I will expect the White Born to give a 32A charge next time, unless last night's 32A charge on the blue Born was a complete fluke.

Previous users have noted that pausing/unpausing the session via the Car Mobile App can result in the car then accepting the full speed being offered by the charger but due to the lateness of the session this isn't always practical.

This isn't at all practical as charge time is 0030:0430. I have considered staying up one day to see the charge actually start and see if the display on the charger indicates 32A or 16A charging, but given last night's successful charge, i'll have to see if the problem has now fixed itself, by looking at the next few charges.

I'll keep you advised over the coming week whether the issue seems to have resolved itself, but given the information above and that this is a recent issue not coinciding with a change in cars or software updates/settings on the cars themselves, I believe this issue's cause still resides with the charger itself, and is possibly linked to the recently implemented delayed start charging imposed by the national grid.

Kind regards,

[sidehaas]

Just an update for anyone interested. Basically they're blaming the car, saying there's historical compatibility issues between ID3/ID4/Enyaq/Born and scheduling - this is clearly bollocks as charging under schedule worked flawlessly with the ID3 for a year and then the Born for 3 months.

Sods law, one of the Borns did a proper charge last night, no idea why, car settings are same in both, I suspect they implemented a fix and are waiting to see if it works. Here's the latest conversation:-

Hi Daryl,

I'll answer your queries/comments below, in red:-



The behaviour you are describing is a known issue for the ID3/4, Cupra and Skoda Enya when they are connected to a smart ev charger. They all share the same battery management system which has a problem with letting the charger control the sessions and especially delay the session after being plugged in rather than the car controlling the session.

I am aware that the newer, more compact Ohme charger has given a lot of EV owners of all marques trouble with scheduled charging (through EV forums), but the older unit like I have seems to be far more reliable and not usually giving many issues reported through the forums, even with VW/Cupra/Skoda EVs. Since installation in May 2021 to around 5 weeks ago, for both our 2 VW ID3s (owned May 2021 to June 2022) and their replacement Cupra Borns (owned from June 2022), we have had no issues with getting a full charge of around 28kWh in the 4 hour Octopus Go Window. With that in mind, I have had 15 months of flawless operation and this issue is new.

If the issues now experienced coincided with the change of cars from ID3 to Cupra Born, i'd be inclined to suspect the car is at fault, but they don't, I have had 3 months of normal operation with the Cupra, and nothing has changed with the Cupra Borns in either settings or any software updates.


What happens is that the car expects when it is plugged in to see power applied straight away, however with a delayed session such as one connected to Octopus GO the car limits the power if it doesn't see the power straight away thus resulting in a slower charge once the charger applies the power. We have a solution for this issue on the ID3/4 range and we are now looking if it is possible to implement this across the other effected cars on the MEB platform.

As i've had 15 months of faultless charging at 32A and then this issue, with no changes to the car/settings/software, the issue of delayed charging you describe hadn't previously occurred. As far as i'm aware, the VW ID3 and Cupra Born are identical under the skin, with the main difference being that the ID3 is far more likely to be running with older software as the updates from 2.3 to 2.4 (including a 12V battery upgrade) and then an over the air update to 3.0, and most UK Cupras were built with 3.0 already installed. If your solution works for an ID3/ID4 running v3.0 software, it's almost a certainty that it will work with a Cupra Born on v3.0. Is this "solution" an applied firmware upgrade to the charger and/or app changes or a recommendation to change settings on the vehicle itself?


I can see that last night (8th-9th) the car accepted the full 32A/7kW for the Go Window. Did you do anything different with this session?

I was surprised to get a proper 32A charge last night. As i've said previously, we have 2 x Cupra Borns that are identical in spec, except paint colour, running the same software and were built in the same month. Last night's charge was with our Blue Cupra Born. The previous 3 nights (06-08 Nov 22) were with our White Cupra Born. The Blue one was the first Cupra Born that I saw the charging issue. It may be a few days before we run the White Born's battery down enough to need 40-50% charge, to see if it is now charging at 32A. Have you changed anything on the charger (firmware) or the app prior to last night's successful 32A charge? Could you also confirm whether my charger's firmware is fully up to date? I will double check that between the 2 cars, all settings on the 2 cars are identical. If they are, I will expect the White Born to give a 32A charge next time, unless last night's 32A charge on the blue Born was a complete fluke.

Previous users have noted that pausing/unpausing the session via the Car Mobile App can result in the car then accepting the full speed being offered by the charger but due to the lateness of the session this isn't always practical.

This isn't at all practical as charge time is 0030:0430. I have considered staying up one day to see the charge actually start and see if the display on the charger indicates 32A or 16A charging, but given last night's successful charge, i'll have to see if the problem has now fixed itself, by looking at the next few charges.

I'll keep you advised over the coming week whether the issue seems to have resolved itself, but given the information above and that this is a recent issue not coinciding with a change in cars or software updates/settings on the cars themselves, I believe this issue's cause still resides with the charger itself, and is possibly linked to the recently implemented delayed start charging imposed by the national grid.

Kind regards,

Just in case Ohme do not solve this for you...my understanding from their comms at the time is that Ohme do not implement the random delayed start time if you have asked for a sufficient amount of electricity that doing so would prevent you from achieving full charge in the cheap period. So basically by ensuring the charger plans a full 4-hour charge in a 4-hour limited period then it won't do the random delayed start. Don't know if that knowledge helps.

[ItshardtobuyId3]

Just an update for anyone interested. Basically they're blaming the car, saying there's historical compatibility issues between ID3/ID4/Enyaq/Born and scheduling - this is clearly bollocks as charging under schedule worked flawlessly with the ID3 for a year and then the Born for 3 months.

Not this bloody problem again. I feel your pain! My Cupra doesn’t have this problem YET, but I might know why yours went full rate.

When I had all this grief with my ID3 before they created the wake line profile (which I’m guessing is still there and you could try) I worked out that I didn’t seem to get the problem ever if I set the charger to add 39% on the 4 hour window.

My theory was that it scheduled as 4kW charge for a few mins then a 7kW for the rest and when they showed me the logs it wasn’t that and can’t remember what it was but it worked nevertheless.

39% actually added 45% because they considered the battery capacity to be the full capacity not the useable one.

I think they may have stopped using the full capacity now. In the email to them it said it worked if I set it to around 5% less than the Ohme thought it could deliver in the 4 hour window. So you could set it to add 100%, see what % it says it will add and change the target to that -5%.

Anyway, it never worked if the charge was more than could be delivered in the 4 hours or a fair bit less as then it scheduled all sorts of weird things and go too slow. But a little bit less than the car could actually take in that window always worked.

Might be worth a try… good luck

[sidehaas]

The ID3 CPWL profile still exists, I still use it.

[monkeyhanger]

Thanks everyone. My schedule has always been to add 80% between 0030 and 0430 (it can only do 52% at 32A), never changed that. I had always left the Ohme thinking that I had an ID3 connected (as per the app), from the day of first ID3 ownership until the issue manifested itself on the Borns. Its only at that point that I changed the car type in the app to Cupra Born - and it didn't fix the issue.

Added charge was set to 80%, I have just adjusted that down to 50%, which is achievable. When I run the white one down a bit we'll see what the next charge does.

[monkeyhanger]

The ID3 CPWL profile still exists, I still use it.

That's the aforementioned "wake" profile?

Will give it a try if the white Born doesn't give a proper 4hr x 32A charge next time.

[sidehaas]

The ID3 CPWL profile still exists, I still use it.

That's the aforementioned "wake" profile?

Will give it a try if the white Born doesn't give a proper 4hr x 32A charge next time.

Yes, it's called something like ID3 First CPWL.

[G43FAN]

I've said it elsewhere, OHME seem to have made this about as complicated as they could. The charging specifications, document that SoC is not communicated over AC so basing your whole charging process on achieving a target you can't see was a non starter. I bought an OHME Smart granny charger when Octopus had them on offer and after a handful of attempts to use the app realised it was a long way from the simplicity of my Zappi.
No help to anyone but the Zappi has worked on timed charge giving full 7.4kW overnight on 2.0, 2.1, 2.3 and now 2.4 faultlessly. All the car does is limit to 80% or 100% on rare occasions.

[Raxacorico]

I've said it elsewhere, OHME seem to have made this about as complicated as they could. The charging specifications, document that SoC is not communicated over AC so basing your whole charging process on achieving a target you can't see was a non starter. I bought an OHME Smart granny charger when Octopus had them on offer and after a handful of attempts to use the app realised it was a long way from the simplicity of my Zappi.
No help to anyone but the Zappi has worked on timed charge giving full 7.4kW overnight on 2.0, 2.1, 2.3 and now 2.4 faultlessly. All the car does is limit to 80% or 100% on rare occasions.

G43FAN - this is exactly what I do with my Zappi. Never fails. Only 80/90% or 100% set in the car. I've never attempted any other scenario.
I estimate what I need, based upon experience. No App. needed! I have a three hour window of cheaper [not cheap!] electricity; so I leave the Zappi set to that, for any day of the week.

[ItshardtobuyId3]

I've said it elsewhere, OHME seem to have made this about as complicated as they could. The charging specifications, document that SoC is not communicated over AC so basing your whole charging process on achieving a target you can't see was a non starter. I bought an OHME Smart granny charger when Octopus had them on offer and after a handful of attempts to use the app realised it was a long way from the simplicity of my Zappi.
No help to anyone but the Zappi has worked on timed charge giving full 7.4kW overnight on 2.0, 2.1, 2.3 and now 2.4 faultlessly. All the car does is limit to 80% or 100% on rare occasions.

To be fair to them when it works it’s great. With the ID3 it uses the API so knows what the SoC is. There isn’t support for that yet with the Born but it’s coming.

Without the API is easy to see what the target is and change it on the app or on the chargers display directly. All these fancy features mean it’s compatible with intelligent octopus as they remotely set the scheduling to suit them.

The problem does seem be with the car not liking some of the weird things it schedules (on the pro at least). The wake line profile fixed that for me. My Cupra doesn’t seem to mind at all, so perhaps my car is running later software or Ohme have actually introduced a new fault with the original Ohme.

It’s not hard to work out the target yourself. Mine is on 49% at the moment. I told it I want 21% tomorrow (as I want 70%) and Octopus have scheduled this: