Motorway speed power consumption

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colonelpurple
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Post by colonelpurple »

monkeyhanger wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 12:43 pm In a car that can cost pennies to fuel with Octopus GO, I'm amazed how efficiency obsessed some people are. If you're doing a 210 mile round trip and want to get there and back without stopping to charge, I could understand that, but to obsess about tootling around at 55-60 miles an hour to perhaps save literally a couple of pence totally astounds me.

In the Summer with a dab of aircon:-

60mph cruise speed ~ 4.4mi p kWh
70mph cruise speed ~ 3.6mi p kWh
80mph cruise speed ~ 3.2mi p kWh

Unless you're embarking on a 200+ mile journey, drive it like you stole it or drive it like a nun might be the difference of saving £3 a month.
completely agree

on one hand I think having an understanding of efficiency, which you can employ as the journey needs is a good thing, but its seriously taking away enjoyment of the car by limiting your speed, cheaping out on comfort (ACC or heating) or having to jump from lorry to lorry on the motorway (strikes me as dangerous as well)

It is also looking like we have to charge our ID3 less times a month then I had to fill up the BMW 2. Simply as the ID3 is more efficient in town where most of our driving is, and I think the range is actually much further in town then a petrol car. On the motorway, 120m to Bournemouth is 1/3 tank of petrol. Just over half on the ID3. Crucially, it doesnt effect anything about the journey or fill up frequency on holiday ...
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roadhawk
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Post by roadhawk »

monkeyhanger wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 12:43 pm

In the Summer with a dab of aircon:-

60mph cruise speed ~ 4.4mi p kWh
70mph cruise speed ~ 3.6mi p kWh
80mph cruise speed ~ 3.2mi p kWh

This pretty much matches what I see. I do a regular run of 165 miles from Oxford to Leeds , with ACC set to 70-72mph, AC ON usually around18C and get 3.7 miles/kwh in the dry. I found this last Sunday that with some rain at the start consumption was up a tad and ended at 3.6.
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Daveion
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Post by Daveion »

colonelpurple wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 1:40 pm
monkeyhanger wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 12:43 pm In a car that can cost pennies to fuel with Octopus GO, I'm amazed how efficiency obsessed some people are. If you're doing a 210 mile round trip and want to get there and back without stopping to charge, I could understand that, but to obsess about tootling around at 55-60 miles an hour to perhaps save literally a couple of pence totally astounds me.

In the Summer with a dab of aircon:-

60mph cruise speed ~ 4.4mi p kWh
70mph cruise speed ~ 3.6mi p kWh
80mph cruise speed ~ 3.2mi p kWh

Unless you're embarking on a 200+ mile journey, drive it like you stole it or drive it like a nun might be the difference of saving £3 a month.
completely agree

on one hand I think having an understanding of efficiency, which you can employ as the journey needs is a good thing, but its seriously taking away enjoyment of the car by limiting your speed, cheaping out on comfort (ACC or heating) or having to jump from lorry to lorry on the motorway (strikes me as dangerous as well)

It is also looking like we have to charge our ID3 less times a month then I had to fill up the BMW 2. Simply as the ID3 is more efficient in town where most of our driving is, and I think the range is actually much further in town then a petrol car. On the motorway, 120m to Bournemouth is 1/3 tank of petrol. Just over half on the ID3. Crucially, it doesnt effect anything about the journey or fill up frequency on holiday ...
I can see the points made but as a slower
long-journey driver I dont limit my speed primarily for efficiency. I choose a speed I'm comfortable with for the road Im travelling and the duration of the journey. Im not missing out on anything. Its actually more enjoyable on long runs.
I confess to being mean with cabin temperature though. The wasted combustion heat is the only thing I miss from an ICE.
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Warminster id
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Post by Warminster id »

I agree with daveion
Just enjoy the ride and relax
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OllyExeterID3
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Post by OllyExeterID3 »

Warminster id wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 8:44 am I agree with daveion
Just enjoy the ride and relax
Yep me too! Since we moved over to EVs, it was initially efficiency that I was obsessed with but then I realised that I enjoyed cruising at 65mph on motorways and generally just enjoyed the journey more! When charging infrastructure was worse (the heady days of 2017/18), it was more about making sure we had enough range to get to a 'plan B' charger on a long journey (with 10 miles range left and two chargers broken....we have had a few close moments!). For any 200 mile or less round trip, then it isn't an issue.

But yes, slow and steady, enjoy the ride, probably won't take you any longer with traffic etc!
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Post by ColinID3 »

ColinID3 wrote: ↑
Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:32 am
I have found it is easy to regularly get 200 usable miles (20-30 miles left in reserve) by setting the speed limiter to 73mph, (it is so easy for the speed to creep up if you don't), plus use the A/C to pull the temperature down at the start of the journey, maintain with fresh air ventilation after that.
I've done 7,500 miles to date at least half of that is long distance motorway driving.
Hi Colin
What is your long term average miles/kw?
I have done 3,000 miles in 6 months with a LTA of 4.2m/kw that includes the really cold start to the year. I'm interested to see if my conservative driving makes much difference.
Hi Dave
I am sitting at 3.8m/kWhr. over 4800 miles, (since 2.1 upgrade)
I don't focus on energy consumption on journeys under 150 miles - I enjoy the standing start acceleration when ever possible!
On longer journeys if I have a convenient coffee stop/short-top-up I do.
My c. 200 mile journeys are always to a location (eg home!) where I have100% confirmed charge at the end of the journey. The fastest door to door time on these journeys is to contain the cruise speed and don't stop to charge!
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Post by monkeyhanger »

For me there's nothing worse than sitting at 60-65mph and being stuck with all the trucks trying to overtake each other doing 1mph quicker than the other one, having the ACC slow you down when you get close as everyone else sails past you. Must feel good to know that you saved.8p in electricity on that 50 mile journey.

Save another 5p by sweating buckets in your car because having the aircon on knocks 0.2 miles per kWh off your efficiency. Absolutely crazy.

Hanging off a truck'sback bumper by hypermiling in its slipstream is just bonkers too, as well as dangerous.
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Daveion
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Post by Daveion »

ColinID3 wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 10:12 am
ColinID3 wrote: ↑
Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:32 am
I have found it is easy to regularly get 200 usable miles (20-30 miles left in reserve) by setting the speed limiter to 73mph, (it is so easy for the speed to creep up if you don't), plus use the A/C to pull the temperature down at the start of the journey, maintain with fresh air ventilation after that.
I've done 7,500 miles to date at least half of that is long distance motorway driving.
Hi Colin
What is your long term average miles/kw?
I have done 3,000 miles in 6 months with a LTA of 4.2m/kw that includes the really cold start to the year. I'm interested to see if my conservative driving makes much difference.
Hi Dave
I am sitting at 3.8m/kWhr. over 4800 miles, (since 2.1 upgrade)
I don't focus on energy consumption on journeys under 150 miles - I enjoy the standing start acceleration when ever possible!
On longer journeys if I have a convenient coffee stop/short-top-up I do.
My c. 200 mile journeys are always to a location (eg home!) where I have100% confirmed charge at the end of the journey. The fastest door to door time on these journeys is to contain the cruise speed and don't stop to charge!
Thanks Colin
Its not a huge difference is it. The only thing I need to relax a bit is the use of the heating. I use the power and torque when Im on my own so totally happy with my mixed driving /slower speeds on the longer runs.
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Post by Deleted User 314 »

monkeyhanger wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 1:22 pm For me there's nothing worse than sitting at 60-65mph and being stuck with all the trucks trying to overtake each other doing 1mph quicker than the other one, having the ACC slow you down when you get close as everyone else sails past you. Must feel good to know that you saved.8p in electricity on that 50 mile journey.

Save another 5p by sweating buckets in your car because having the aircon on knocks 0.2 miles per kWh off your efficiency. Absolutely crazy.

Hanging off a truck'sback bumper by hypermiling in its slipstream is just bonkers too, as well as dangerous.
We drive our car for fun and we really have fun, even clocking the km remaining dropping like a stone when we're zooming up a hill

We have a cursory look at the KM remaining and then just drive it. Aircon set to 21.5 winter and summer and drive away.

We've had the car long enough to know where all the free fast chargers are (and there are a lot here) and where the chargeable ones are located too.

The minute either of are quibbling over 5c here or there then we go ICE

And we ain't going ICE ever again :D
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Daveion
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Post by Daveion »

monkeyhanger wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 1:22 pm For me there's nothing worse than sitting at 60-65mph and being stuck with all the trucks trying to overtake each other doing 1mph quicker than the other one, having the ACC slow you down when you get close as everyone else sails past you. Must feel good to know that you saved.8p in electricity on that 50 mile journey.

Save another 5p by sweating buckets in your car because having the aircon on knocks 0.2 miles per kWh off your efficiency. Absolutely crazy.

Hanging off a truck'sback bumper by hypermiling in its slipstream is just bonkers too, as well as dangerous.
🤣 That is as far from the way it works for me as you can get. If I find myself in a convoy I pass it and hit Resume which is likely to be around 63mph 😂.
Hypermiling/ slipstreaming is not something I do.
What I like about this thread is that we are all different. There is no right or wrong way. Nothing bonkers or crazy. You like to drive faster and reach a destination a little earlier. I like to enjoy the drive and relax, its not about cost. Others maybe are focused on max efficiency. Each to their own.
I will look out for you zooming by me to the next queue on the M25 😁
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id73
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Post by id73 »

Just got back from a 290 mile trip from London to Lizard in Cornwall.
We took the ID3 and the Tesla Model 3 as hotel had 2 destination chargers.

Interestingly both cars required 1 stop.
The Tesla needed a 15 min charge and the ID3 needed a 50 min charge.

The Tesla felt like it could have done the whole journey without stopping if driven carefully and the ID3 needed some careful (slow) driving to make it with one stop.

Overall I was impressed with the ID3 but a one stop strategy gave a bit of range anxiety whereas the Tesla felt much more reassured range wise.

I’d say the main difference in experience on our first long journey was the availability of chargers.
The Tesla supercharging site had around 16 chargers of which 4 were occupied when arrived at lunch time whereas the 3 public chargers for ID3 were all occupied and we had to wait 35 mins for one to become available and then it stopped working requiring us to call BP Pulse for them to reset the machine remotely.

We had a similar experience on the way back. Tesla seemless charging experience, ID3 a bit fraught as some selfish tattooed oik decided to leave his Audi charging at 100% for an extended period whilst he stuffed his face eating with his family whilst we waited for him to release his spot. Tesla charge penalty idling fees for doing this so people don’t do it, whereas no such incentive for good behaviour seems to exist on non-Tesla public chargers.

Not a great first experience with ID3 public charging and much more stressful than the Tesla supercharger experience but as we do this sort of trip only once or twice a year it’s not a deal breaker for the ID3 and on the whole we still love it!
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Post by monkeyhanger »

That scenario is only going to get worse while EV car sales grow much faster than the number of charging points.

A penalty like you describe for Tesla would need to be in pkace to discourage idle hogging of the charger e.g. 30p per kWh while charging and then start charging (money) again at perhaps 5-10p per minute after 5 minutes grace when the charger is supplying no electricity but is connected.

But do you go further than that? Should rapid chargers only be for rapid charging e.g. get to 80% and then get off because that other 20% to 100% is going to take an age? Or maybe you're only allowed on for 30 mins?
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id73
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Post by id73 »

sadly i think the mentaility of charging to 100% on public chargers is still quite pervasive.
as you say this is madness as the r.o.c drop dramatically for the fnal 20% or so
In most cases its just some sort of irrational manifestatio of range anxiety or its just downright anti-social
it might also make sense to charge people a higher rate as the r.o.c drops so it would really make people think about how much they really need that last x% charge as it would cost them exponentially more
charging costs really need to be based on some sort of composite between energy transfer and crucially time spent on the charger.
that would sharpen peoples minds a bit and get them to do the right thing..
colonelpurple
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Post by colonelpurple »

I personally think that people can charge to what they want. I would have no idea if that person is doing another 200miles and needs 100%. Leaving a car in a charging bay without charging is not acceptable, but going to 100% is a personal choice. Its not his fault its the fact there are not enough EV chargers
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Post by OllyExeterID3 »

colonelpurple wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 8:08 pm I personally think that people can charge to what they want. I would have no idea if that person is doing another 200miles and needs 100%. Leaving a car in a charging bay without charging is not acceptable, but going to 100% is a personal choice. Its not his fault its the fact there are not enough EV chargers
I must admit I agree with you here - our old i3 would get us home from Gloucester but only with a full charge - we needed a complete 100% to get home (and had no driveway or charger at home so needed a buffer). So leaving after 80% would mean an extra stop out of our way to charge.

Not so much of an issue now with the ID3 - the range is revolutionary on a long drive! But if we need to charge as close to full as possible, I will wait in the car and, if someone else needs the charger, will disconnect and let them use it. Best courtesy is to keep an eye on the charger - if other people are waiting, then move on as soon as you can.
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Post by G43FAN »

Long distance EV driving has long been sold as possible by using the prolonged charging (as opposed to an ICE refill) as being time to take a break and maybe something to eat. Whilst people 'hogging' chargers may seem to be anti social the overall sales pitch has always been 'chill, take your time and enjoy the journey'.

Let's hope Mr Musk's latest announcement comes to fruition and we get access to those lovely Supercharger points.
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Post by monkeyhanger »

colonelpurple wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 8:08 pm I personally think that people can charge to what they want. I would have no idea if that person is doing another 200miles and needs 100%. Leaving a car in a charging bay without charging is not acceptable, but going to 100% is a personal choice. Its not his fault its the fact there are not enough EV chargers
There's a serious lack of convenience in charging to 100% away from home. If you can get from 20% to 80% in 30 mins or so, but to get to 100% will take you an additional hour at a very slow speed, then surely its morally right and more convenient for all that you get off after 30 mins, do another 100-150 miles and top up again for 20% in 15-20.mins (80% charge in 50 mins over 2 stops rather than hogging the charger for 90.mins to get 20-100%.
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Post by Andreas »

I just charged on an Osprey 50kW from 69-100% in 35 minutes (77kWh battery, total charge 21.76kWh, no I don't understand the math either), in advance of a long trip on Saturday. I suspect the final 20% took 25 minutes of this. It's well within the realm of a coffee break, and given I don't have a home charger I would take a dim view of someone policing me for this.

All the best

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AKVH
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Post by AKVH »

@roadhawk I am thinking of getting a VW id3 - mostly I drive around 30 miles a day but a few times a year I drive up to Leeds - we live just south of Oxford so the journey is around 190 miles. I notice you say you do a regular drive from Oxford to Leeds and I just wondered whether you thought we would make this journey on a single charge or whether in reality we would need to stop on the way to charge?
Would appreciate your thoughts.
Thanks
Abi


This pretty much matches what I see. I do a regular run of 165 miles from Oxford to Leeds , with ACC set to 70-72mph, AC ON usually around18C and get 3.7 miles/kwh in the dry. I found this last Sunday that with some rain at the start consumption was up a tad and ended at 3.6.
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Post by BeesKnees »

I have a simple worst case scenario I'd like your advice on

I'm getting a 58KWh Life Pro in a couple of months, my most regular journey of any distance will be 150 miles to London and back.

Will this car do this with 80% charge if I drive at 70-75mph on a cold\ wet winters night?

I'm beginning to think this will be a close run thing.
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